[VIS] Memorial Drive upgrade

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Algernon
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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#361 Post by Algernon » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:07 pm

SBD: from memory (albeit a long one for me), the hard surface area can accommodate 4 courts side by side. It's hard to make out in that render, but I think they just drew up a single court in the middle. With a little help from the angle of the render, it looks plausible that all seats have some sort of view of that court. In reality it's a nonsense for mine. The stands are roughly 50m+ long and a tennis court is around 11m wide. With a court situated in the middle of the stand, that leaves almost 80% of the spectators not aligned with the court. If the stands had some curve you could have a few more patrons facing the court, but of course the stands are straight as a ruler. If the stands hold 5,000 then I wouldn't count on more than 1,500 at the most being ideal to view a match (and even then, some spectators would be craning their necks). Better hope the match doesn't go to 5 sets :lol:

wrt your question of suitability for any other sports, basketball has similar dimensions to tennis but it would be slightly better by aligning the court east-west. It can't accommodate a soccer pitch in any form other than futsal. I wouldn't think it suitable for concerts either unless some serious engineering is involved in the accoustic performance of that roof (which I doubt).

*edit* I just wanted to add, I don't necessarily think this proposal is a bad one. The old brick facade of the stadium has its charm, and it could be quite a beautiful venue. But it won't be what the Advertiser/Polly is selling it as by a long shot. A nice boutique venue yes, but nothing more.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#362 Post by kenget » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:31 pm

There are no seats on one side? Please explain why this is $10m well spent? Will the Ball Kids need to run half way to the Adelaide Oval entrance to retrieve a ball after a rally? The seating plan would need a complete redesign if this is to be adequate. :2cents:

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#363 Post by arki » Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:35 pm

The individual courts are closed off for matches with temporary seating behind the ball barriers (not sure if they will be up for the new tournament, which would be unusual, but there will still be ball barriers around the court. So no, no one will be running to the other end of AO just as they didn't when we held the Adelaide International.

I presume that for the tournament the facility will house two courts separated by temporary stands - still not ideal and will be far from a capacity of 5000.

Also, not sure if it has been posted before but Tennis Australia will be contributing $1m for minor upgrades of the stands. Not sure what this entails but hopefully it actually improves the amenities on match days because in it's current state the facility will be an embarrassment.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#364 Post by Brucetiki » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:44 pm

Algernon wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:07 pm
SBD: from memory (albeit a long one for me), the hard surface area can accommodate 4 courts side by side. It's hard to make out in that render, but I think they just drew up a single court in the middle. With a little help from the angle of the render, it looks plausible that all seats have some sort of view of that court. In reality it's a nonsense for mine. The stands are roughly 50m+ long and a tennis court is around 11m wide. With a court situated in the middle of the stand, that leaves almost 80% of the spectators not aligned with the court. If the stands had some curve you could have a few more patrons facing the court, but of course the stands are straight as a ruler. If the stands hold 5,000 then I wouldn't count on more than 1,500 at the most being ideal to view a match (and even then, some spectators would be craning their necks). Better hope the match doesn't go to 5 sets :lol:

wrt your question of suitability for any other sports, basketball has similar dimensions to tennis but it would be slightly better by aligning the court east-west. It can't accommodate a soccer pitch in any form other than futsal. I wouldn't think it suitable for concerts either unless some serious engineering is involved in the accoustic performance of that roof (which I doubt).

*edit* I just wanted to add, I don't necessarily think this proposal is a bad one. The old brick facade of the stadium has its charm, and it could be quite a beautiful venue. But it won't be what the Advertiser/Polly is selling it as by a long shot. A nice boutique venue yes, but nothing more.
Memorial Drive has always had 3 show courts side by side. In the Rebound Ace days, the middle court was Rebound Ace (which was used for the Adelaide International), while the courts either side were grass courts (used for Davis Cup ties). When the Australian Open changed to Plexicushion, all 3 show courts became Plexicusion. This meant they used the two outer courts for the final Adelaide International (with the selling point being people could watch two matches at the same time). The WTC used this set up too.

For the Davis Cup last weekend, they used the middle court, with a corporate marquee on one side and temporary stand on the other. The seating at the extreme ends of the court were GA, with the prime seating in front of the court reserved seating. I'd say there'd be a similar set up for the new tournament next year (though I'd dare say the marquee would be replaced with another seating with courtside boxes) - I can't see them going down the setting up two courts side by side path, unless it's necessary to fit both tournaments in.

Also, only Grand Slams are best of 5 for men these days - the Davis Cup dropped to best of 3 this year.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#365 Post by SRW » Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:43 pm

To hasten death of the Findon arena and building the case for a city-based facility, the 36ers are moving to the Entertainment Centre from next season: https://www.outline.com/SyXvWH
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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#366 Post by how good is he » Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:46 pm

It could work permanently for basketball. It has the tram at its doorstep and would allow the Govt to focus on (and save for) a rectangular stadium, which I think would be at least 5 -10 years away.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#367 Post by crawf » Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:47 pm

With the ATP tennis event and now this, it will build a stronger case for a new larger multi-purpose arena.

It will be even more solid if Adelaide proceeds with the bid for the 2026 Comm Games.

Great news

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#368 Post by claybro » Mon Mar 18, 2019 6:32 pm

SRW wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:43 pm
To hasten death of the Findon arena and building the case for a city-based facility, the 36ers are moving to the Entertainment Centre from next season: https://www.outline.com/SyXvWH
Could not be a better move as far as promotion of the 36ers. The stadium at Beverly is tired, cramped and was build in a ridiculous place with no consideration of public transport. Oh, and a least there are a couple of pubs nearby for before and afters. :cheers:

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#369 Post by ml69 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 11:23 pm

From The Advertiser:

THE SA STADIUM SHOWDOWN
Paul Starick
April 12, 2019 10:40pm
Subscriber only
Majority support for a new indoor stadium in Adelaide’s Riverbank precinct has been revealed by an Advertiser survey, amid rival proposals at Memorial Drv and the city railyards estimated to cost $250 million and $700 million respectively.

In a reversal of public opinion, the Advertiser — YouGov Galaxy survey finds 56 per cent support for a roofed, multipurpose arena on the River Torrens banks.

Near-identical levels of opposition to a new stadium in the Adelaide Oval precinct were revealed in the past two annual Sunday Mail Your Say SA surveys, which recorded 55.6 per cent and 54.5 per cent against the idea.

Rival plans for a multi-use arena — housing concerts, events, tennis, basketball and netball — have been prepared by both Tennis SA, for Memorial Drv, and the Adelaide Venue Management Corporation (AVMC), for the CBD railyards.

A preferred stadium plan is expected to be nominated, ahead of a potential Commonwealth Games feasibility study due in August, in a State Sporting Infrastructure Plan expected next month or early June.


An artist's impression of the proposed multipurpose Adelaide Arena. Source: The Advertiser

The Memorial Drive Redevelopment proposal.


The Advertiser has been told the construction cost of the Memorial Drv option, at a seating capacity of about 15,000 people, has been estimated at $250 million.

The railyards option is put at $700 million, because it has a greater capacity and a retractable grass soccer pitch.

It is understood this option involves a substantial platform being built over the rail lines, also for a major commercial development, including a hotel, capitalising on the nearby Royal Adelaide Hospital.

Both venues would rely on selling the Adelaide Entertainment Centre at Hindmarsh, which The Advertiser has been told might gain about $30 million to defray an arena’s cost.

A new arena would rely on events, conventions and concerts, some of which now bypass Adelaide, for the substantial part of its revenue.

It is estimated the increased economic activity for the state as a result of a multipurpose stadium might be between $100 million and $200 million.

The Advertiser last September revealed a business case was being prepared by the AVMC, which operates the Entertainment Centre, Adelaide Convention Centre and Hindmarsh Stadium.

AVMC chairman Bill Spurr, also a member of Premier Steven Marshall’s six-person Economic Advisory Council, declined to comment.

State Liberal Party president and Adelaide Oval Stadium Management Authority deputy chairman John Olsen has backed the Memorial Drv option, saying the capital cost would be reduced by using the security, food, beverage, kitchens and other facilities already built at the revamped Adelaide Oval, as part of a $535 million, publicly funded upgrade opened in 2014.

The YouGov Galaxy online survey of a representative sample of voters comprised 2225 respondents nationally, of which 503 South Australians answered the question about a multipurpose arena.

A State Government spokesman highlighted the $10 million announced in February for a new Memorial Drv roof, which has resulted in a new week-long international tennis event from next year.

He said the Sporting Infrastructure Plan would “include longer-term considerations of a new stadium, and possible locations, in comparison, or conjunction, with resources spread out over grassroots clubs”.

An Opposition spokesman said a Riverbank arena had merit and was worth exploring.

“However, the Marshall Liberal Government appears to have made up its mind by spending $10 million on a roof at the existing Memorial Drv,” he said.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#370 Post by ml69 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:29 am

ml69 wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 11:23 pm
The Advertiser has been told the construction cost of the Memorial Drv option, at a seating capacity of about 15,000 people, has been estimated at $250 million.

The railyards option is put at $700 million, because it has a greater capacity and a retractable grass soccer pitch.
I think the most feasible option is a 15,000 seat arena at the rail yards.

Why?
To fit a 15,000 seat arena at Memorial Drive will involve the complete demolition of Memorial Drive facility (after having spent $10M roofing it). Next Gen gym will also have to be demolished ... presumably the owners will require compensation and/or want their building rebuilt somewhere else. Also the recently completed Indoor Cricket Centre will probably have to be demolished too, to be rebuilt somewhere else. Therefore it starts looking like it’s in the too-hard-basket.

However, by building the 15,000 seat arena on the riverfront land between the railyards and the Torrens, none of these issues exist. And I doubt you would even need the expense of a deck over the rail yards, because sufficient space already exists.

In relation to the AVMC proposal which includes the retractable soccer pitch, I’d love to see this go ahead but my head tells me the state govt would baulk at a $700M price tag given we’ve just had hundreds of millions of GST distributions taken away from SA. The only possible way this could ever go ahead is if we won the 2026 Comm Games and the federal govt pitched in 50% of the cost.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#371 Post by Patrick_27 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:17 am

ml69 wrote:
Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:29 am
ml69 wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 11:23 pm
The Advertiser has been told the construction cost of the Memorial Drv option, at a seating capacity of about 15,000 people, has been estimated at $250 million.

The railyards option is put at $700 million, because it has a greater capacity and a retractable grass soccer pitch.
I think the most feasible option is a 15,000 seat arena at the rail yards.

Why?
To fit a 15,000 seat arena at Memorial Drive will involve the complete demolition of Memorial Drive facility (after having spent $10M roofing it). Next Gen gym will also have to be demolished ... presumably the owners will require compensation and/or want their building rebuilt somewhere else. Also the recently completed Indoor Cricket Centre will probably have to be demolished too, to be rebuilt somewhere else. Therefore it starts looking like it’s in the too-hard-basket.

However, by building the 15,000 seat arena on the riverfront land between the railyards and the Torrens, none of these issues exist. And I doubt you would even need the expense of a deck over the rail yards, because sufficient space already exists.

In relation to the AVMC proposal which includes the retractable soccer pitch, I’d love to see this go ahead but my head tells me the state govt would baulk at a $700M price tag given we’ve just had hundreds of millions of GST distributions taken away from SA. The only possible way this could ever go ahead is if we won the 2026 Comm Games and the federal govt pitched in 50% of the cost.
What you've mentioned are small roadblocks in the scheme of things. At the end of the day, this is about maximising the budget and consolidation. Not to mention that building a new arena on the rail-yards that is going to cost $450m more. It's the same argument that was had over consolidating cricket and football into one venue rather than having two, and look how well it's turned out. That said, if you were to bring Soccer into the mix as is the case in the rail-yards proposal, you'd then find that clashes start to appear between the different sporting codes and other entertainment that use the venue.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#372 Post by ml69 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 7:29 am

Patrick_27 wrote:
Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:17 am
What you've mentioned are small roadblocks in the scheme of things. At the end of the day, this is about maximising the budget and consolidation. Not to mention that building a new arena on the rail-yards that is going to cost $450m more. It's the same argument that was had over consolidating cricket and football into one venue rather than having two, and look how well it's turned out. That said, if you were to bring Soccer into the mix as is the case in the rail-yards proposal, you'd then find that clashes start to appear between the different sporting codes and other entertainment that use the venue.
What I meant was building the $250M 15,000 seat arena (without soccer pitch) on the land in front of the railyards is the most feasible option. By the way, I think it will cost way more than $250M .... likely to be $300M+ (Brisbane has a similar proposal for a 17,000 seat arena which is estimated at $450M).

It’s the most affordable option and doesn’t have the logistical complications of the Memorial Drive location, which can effectively remain as it is (but with a new roof for the tennis court). In the situation where blockbuster tennis matches requiring greater seating capacity need to be played, these can be played at the new arena.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#373 Post by rev » Sat Apr 13, 2019 8:58 am

That proposal or idea for the stadium over the rail lines is stupid.
The only thing positive about it is it is directly next to the train station. But the pedestrian bridge over the river nullifies that anyway as it's a short walk straight into the train station.

The best option is redeveloping the existing Memorial Drive stadium and the surrounding outdoor courts.
If they have $700 million to spend on a stadium, why not redevelop Memorial Drive for $250 million and spend the rest on building a rectangular stadium for soccer/rugby/smaller outdoor concerts like those at Hindmarsh....?

They're serious about a Commonwealth Games bid aren't they? or is that just BS to distract people from real issues....like the disgusting state of most of our roads...

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#374 Post by mattwinter » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:25 pm

rev wrote:
Sat Apr 13, 2019 8:58 am
That proposal or idea for the stadium over the rail lines is stupid.
The only thing positive about it is it is directly next to the train station. But the pedestrian bridge over the river nullifies that anyway as it's a short walk straight into the train station.

The best option is redeveloping the existing Memorial Drive stadium and the surrounding outdoor courts.
If they have $700 million to spend on a stadium, why not redevelop Memorial Drive for $250 million and spend the rest on building a rectangular stadium for soccer/rugby/smaller outdoor concerts like those at Hindmarsh....?

They're serious about a Commonwealth Games bid aren't they? or is that just BS to distract people from real issues....like the disgusting state of most of our roads...
100% agree... I wonder how realistic this is or just an Advertiser journalist having a bit of fun. Considering how hard it was for the government to get the Adelaide Oval upgrade done (which was around 600 million?), I don't think 700 million for one indoor stadium is going to happen. Nor should it, thinking of potential clashes between a-league, NBL and tennis. For $500 million you could do a great upgrade to memorial drive and build a boutique rectangular stadium too.

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[VIS] Re: Memorial Drive upgrade

#375 Post by madelaide » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:31 pm

In the attached mock up, I've illustrated three site options for a 20,000 - 25,000 seat stadium.

I personally can't see how either option A.(rail lines) or B. (Memorial Drive) would work.

A. Building a stadium for world football / rugby / concerts requires more land than is currently available at option A. taking into consideration necessary pedestrian access. Connecting the site to the Railway Station via the riverside walk would be a significant benefit to the economy along that stretch, however, I don't think it's worth the $700M + to build in the heart of the medical precinct. I'd like to see that land set aside for future medical/science related industries.

Even if the stadium's orientation was rotated 90 degrees, having one end facing into the sun is less than ideal. Docklands Stadium in Melbourne has had problems with the turf since day one. The sandy surface and shadow factor have caused dramas for players across all codes. There's been a strong argument for pulling Docklands down and rebuilding it closer to the MGG-spot.

It's also really not worth the extra effort to disrupt train services during construction.

B. Building a 20,000 - 25,000 seat stadium next to Adelaide Oval appears fine until you factor in the Village Green mob. Popped collars don't move on that easily. More so, I can't see the cricket and tennis associations giving up their pitches/courts without a fight/stacks of cash. The space might be better suited to a 12,000 seat arena (tennis / basketball / netball / concerts) with retractable roof built on the site of Next Gen. A fitness / health /wellbeing centre could be incorporated into the design. Retaining the current tennis centre with the proposed half-assed renovation might be useful for minor tennis matches in a tournament. Reconfiguring seating in an all purpose stadium would be a design and implementation nightmare.

C. This may be a little controversial but I believe the Torrens Parade Ground might be moved to the Northern suburbs defence hub. Historically, I understand the sentimentality and significance of the current site, though the War Memorial does a better job of representing our respect for the fallen. The Pioneer Women's, Vietnam Vet and Ester Lipman gardens could be features of the reclaimed Botanic Gardens immediately east of Lot 14.
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